Corny vs Cheesy Explained

Speaker 1 0:00

that I actually have a deep , what is my like mc voice ?

Speaker 2 0:03

like there you go , hello everyone hello , I don't think I've ever heard that that welcome to the wedding , sandra and todd . Oh , there you go is that gonna have a good ?

Speaker 1 0:15

time tonight , let's go love that um .

Speaker 2 0:20

Is that your ?

Speaker 1 0:20

that's your wedding voice . It's is probably over-sexified it just now , but more than I would .

Speaker 2 0:26

Sexified .

Speaker 1 0:27

I don't know if I've ever heard that word before ? Dude , but you know what it means . Oh for sure dude Sexified , I love words that aren't words , and you know what they mean . Yeah , have you ever ?

Speaker 2 0:39

said something and you're like that's never been said before ever in life , Like I was the first person to combine those words together .

Speaker 1 0:51

I don't know if I've said that , I don't know if I've thought that , but I've thought , like I've thought about when I use a word for the first time , how did I used to use it ? Like , is this the first time ? Like , how does that feel ? Yeah , how's this new word feel , yeah , how , yeah , I used to use that . Like is this the first time ? Like , how does that feel ? Yeah , how does this new word feel , yeah , I've been using corny a lot lately and I don't feel like I used the word corny before and I was wondering , like , what is I know the difference between corny and cheesy intuitively and in music . It's really important , right , it's ?

Speaker 2 1:19

what , what is ?

Speaker 1 1:20

that difference you're always like , and then I was thinking it's hard to kind of explain . But I guess yeah , it is hard . I was thinking how do I explain the difference between cheesy and corny ?

Speaker 2 1:34

Well , it's cheese and corn .

Speaker 1 1:37

I mean it's . It can be kind of used interchangeably , of course . Yeah , it's a different food group . Yeah , sometimes I would say like cheesy it tends food group . Yeah , I would say cheesy it tends to be . Like the lyrics are kind of cheesy or like something about a melody might be cheesy , but corny might be more about someone's like style or brand or personality , like not as musically related music . I feel like , yeah , there's like corny music too .

Speaker 2 2:10

But you know , when I think of corny music I think of like cotton eye joe ah , right , yeah , yeah corny yeah , or like the seventh inning stretch , but I think of some like yeah , like some like cliche pop stuff as proud to be an american .

Speaker 1 2:27

What is that ?

Speaker 2 2:28

that's corny yeah that's corny okay , what about like um , like 50 cent ? I got the magic stick , something else . Some that's something else . Okay . Okay , let me try and think of something else .

Speaker 1 2:44

That's something else .

Speaker 2 2:45

Okay , okay , let me try and think of something else that would be corny or cheesy , okay .

Speaker 1 2:51

Let's see here . I had to pick corny yeah .

Speaker 2 2:54

Corny for that one . Yeah , well , actually . So it's funny that you say that . Yeah , the difference , because my last name is Cornwall . Yeah , and so corny . I've been that that word has been used , uh , throughout my whole life . Um , so , uh , but but what it has .

Speaker 1 3:13

you know , I don't even think that , as I started talking about corny , yeah .

Speaker 2 3:16

Right . So it makes me think of you know the difference , um , but with cheesy . I always thought that love music was cheesy , right and then the corny music was like corny dance yeah , that's just where my uh , my head goes yeah with that , yeah .

Speaker 2 3:41

And then when we're talking about cheesy , I thought about when I was younger , with love tracks . I always thought I would never write music that that would be cheesy . I kind of opened myself up into a different box and I will admit that some of my music would be categorized . Some of my love tracks would be categorized as cheesy , you know to others . But I think it's like where is it coming from ? You know like where ? Where is the intention of the track ?

Speaker 1 4:24

Yeah , and just like with cooking , it's like I love cheese . It's like how much there you go , do you use , do you sprinkle it on ? You know , you know , I look back at some of my tracks and , yeah , like there's some , there's some cheesiness going on certain certain areas , um , and yeah , like , as I think about where I'm gravitating , like I am going more , less , I feel like to a less cheese-free environment , but I I got , you got to respect the cheese you got to .

Speaker 1 4:55

The cheese is there , it's , it's , it's out there , it's just like yeah , and corny too . I mean , everyone's got their thing , yeah , um , I don't . I'm trying to remember why I started talking about this , but let me do .

Speaker 2 5:11

Let me do one thing .

Speaker 1 5:12

Yeah , is this still like the pre-podcast ?

Speaker 2 5:30

so welcome . Respecting perspectives podcast crew .

Building Accountability in Music Production

Speaker 2 5:34

I have a special guest here with me today . He is a native of baltimore , the the burbs of baltimore , they say the Burbs . He is an artist , a piano aficionado . He has inspired me to delve into a few different kinds of music , especially house and electronic , but he makes many different types of music . I have today with me Neil Nines . Thank you , appreciate you . Yeah , thanks for being here , man . Hey , well , first off , what do you think ? Is this set up ? Are you comfortable ? Are we good ? Is this is this ? Is this , is this how it should be ?

Speaker 1 6:28

I feel good , okay , is there anywhere I should be looking Like , or ?

Speaker 2 6:31

just like at you , is there like , I guess , like the ?

Speaker 1 6:34

cameras there . Yeah , I would say like these two angles .

Speaker 2 6:38

Yeah , you can look wherever the heck you want , dude , yeah , yeah , yeah , and the cameras will look where they want .

Speaker 1 6:44

So , uh , yeah , they'll find you , I love the camera setup , I love what you guys uh have been doing with this place and thank you for introducing me . I think the way you introduced me you chose piano aficionado probably because of this uh place and me playing piano right over there , which for me , has been a big deal , actually like a really big deal . Yeah , um , with everything I've been going through lately in terms of , yeah , who , who am I , you know , and I think that's something the jack of all trades thing has definitely been a thing for me playing multiple instruments , djing , producing and I just keep building it all up you know , I can see , I can tell man .

Speaker 1 7:32

And lately I just hired a vocal coach so started to sing on my own tracks and perform and write and just diving into a whole new world . But it's the world I came from originally too . I have a question for you with that ?

Speaker 2 7:51

What is your goal from this vocal ? Or do you even have a goal of the vocal coach itself and your vocals themselves ?

Speaker 1 8:04

Yeah , I mean definitely want to execute on my tracks as good as possible , like getting the especially like the pitch right , getting the breathing right . Really , the more you can nail it , the less you have to mess with , like the melodining and the auto-tune , I think the better . But more importantly I think in that regard is being able to confidently perform live and know that I'm like nailing it , you know each time , uh , consistently yeah , and it's it's like any other thing , except your body becomes the instrument .

Speaker 1 8:37

but if you're training it consistently , I feel like that's , why wouldn't you do that if you're trying to level up and for me , I need to develop that I mean , you obviously have been doing it for a while , so you know what you need . But yeah , I think it's for accountability too , more than anything in a lot of ways .

Speaker 2 8:59

I've noticed that with you recently , with some of the sessions that we , that we've had , and just kind of noticing your accountability and how , to you know , stay on top of things and how to to not just hold yourself accountable , but how can you also , you know , hold the people around you accountable as well ? You know , know it's an important factor in our lives .

Speaker 1 9:27

Do you feel like accountability is something that maybe , like that , that isn't worked on as much you know in this day and age , or do you think yeah , I think it depends , Like when we're individual entrepreneurs and doing it ourselves , there's no systems or structures in place that force accountability , like a , like a day job . Um , however , there are obviously consequences , but if you're trying to build and grow and optimize , then , yeah , I think it becomes important because I know , or we know , that we're . Are we working our asses off ? Are we doing as much as we can ? I mean , if I have to look at myself in the mirror , I have to say , at times perhaps , but consistently over the longterm , I feel like there's so much more room for growth and I think it's really helped with that in getting things done consistently .

Speaker 2 10:25

And let me , let me ask you how have you been able to hold yourself accountable recently ? What are some of the things that you've been doing ?

Speaker 1 10:34

So I have a group , I meet with two other producers . Accountability , oh cool . We set goals and we meet every week and we talk about our goals and what we're struggling with , whether we hit them or not . Um , music goals , production goals , administrative goals like registering stuff , you know , and and sound exchange yeah , just like little , those little things that you have to do or should do . Um , learning goals and marketing goals .

Speaker 2 11:05

Yeah .

Speaker 1 11:05

And trying to have at least something every week that move all of those things , but some weeks it might be art . I really got to like focus on the production . Yeah , and it's been good we put money on the line . Oh , really , okay , originally I think that's kind of like falling off a little , but could you give me a detail , a little bit dive into detail ?

Speaker 2 11:25

give me a detail , a little bit dive into detail about , about that a little bit yeah , when I first like you don't have to say like figures themselves , but like how is the money ? Yeah , you know , you know how does the money help in in the situation ?

Speaker 1 11:38

yeah , I think . Well , we agreed to amount , that we felt like , if we failed and we had to pay it , it stings , but it's not like , yeah , a huge one , you know , but it still stings enough that , like you , if you keep getting hit with it , you're just like all right , come

Musical Journey and Accountability in Music

Speaker 1 11:54

on . Yeah , I'm either not setting my goal , like there's no love , that expectation about how big goals you set , but it's that you set a clear goal that's measurable and did you hit it or not ? You know , uh , huh , um , and so many of us , you know , struggle with that like one thing we have to do but like , for some reason , it's just , yeah , feels so daunting , it's out there .

Speaker 2 12:18

Um , I would feel yeah , sorry to interrupt , but I feel like my .

Speaker 2 12:21

the thing that is like that for me is and I know it sounds small , but the lyrics from from my tracks themselves , having the lyrics and you know how , when you're in like Instagram or um , you know Tik TOK or Facebook , when you're like posting a story , and you can post the lyrics to the to the song yeah , in a story or a reel and the the lyrics are also timed to , where you know when the person is saying that lyric it kind of highlights well , you have to take that takes some special and extra time to do that , and I always feel like that's something that I have a hard time staying accountable with . So now that we're kind of even talking about it , I'll make an effort to do that myself . So thanks for the reminder .

Speaker 1 13:22

Yeah , myself . So thanks for the reminder . Yeah , and that also makes me think about like there's so many like little tiny things that it gets overwhelming when , when the list grows . But then you have to ask yourself like okay , what is the one thing if I do all the other stuff doesn't even matter ah , that's a good point right and I think , yeah , I think that comes down . If you can make music , that really is something that really makes a stamp and you can market it , well then , yeah .

Speaker 1 14:04

Obviously , those are the two , that's obviously . That's . Those are the two big things , and that's sounds simpler than done . Right but easy to say easy to say , but sometimes I think , even the music side we got to think we got to spend way more time on that . Like not time , I think , I don't know , it's not the time . Yeah , it's the like soul-searching and so like when you're in that session that the the stuff that's coming out is like the best stuff that can come out yeah .

Speaker 2 14:37

So do me a favor and give me a little bit of a background on the instruments or the type of music that you have made throughout your life , maybe kind of starting at , you know , when you were younger and you know I know you were in a college band and whatnot . Why don't you tell me a little bit , yeah , and the people out here tell them a little bit about your history with , with , with music itself ? Yeah , get comfy too .

Speaker 1 15:08

You know what I mean , yeah no , just as like a warm-up sit , like getting my bearings with the weights of the cushions and how they redistribute and , like my jean , like crotch situation which is still a work in progress .

Speaker 2 15:22

It always will be dude . It always will be okay .

Speaker 1 15:26

Yeah , Okay . So yeah , piano was first . How old ? Were you , I was five , between the age of five and 11 . My parents were immigrants from the Soviet Union . My mom played piano . For her that was like something I should pursue , okay , um , classical piano , music theory . I went to Peabody , uh , conservatory , for , like kids you know , um , so we it was like twice a week , uh , that I would go there Very prestigious , let's just say that .

Speaker 2 16:03

But it sounds prestigious , right went to p-bot , yeah .

Speaker 1 16:08

So yeah , like nice little resume thing there and obviously um , good to get for me at that young age . Um , because I wasn't even that into it , to be honest , like I , I liked it , but it wasn't . So what happened was , you know , I became a pre-teen and like , as we all do , yes and like pre-teen , like piano's kind of nerdy and right , you know I'm trying to be trying to elevate my social status , getting into some sports , you know , starting to get an eye for the ladies .

Speaker 1 16:46

But I remember picking up . I'm like visualizing this now . I remember I was in my cousin's or aunt and uncle's apartment in New York , in Manhattan , and there were CDs , and there was an Aerosmith CD , oh shoot , and I heard Dream On for the first time . And so , yeah , how'd you feel ? Describe the feeling , like what were some of the emotions ?

Speaker 2 17:16

Yeah , take yourself , you know you've got to close your eyes and dream on a little bit you know , yeah , yeah , put yourself in the time machine Cause , like yourself in the , in the time machine , getting in the zone here .

Speaker 1 17:31

Yeah , I mean , it's just like this energy taking over the body that a song could be so like epic and inspiring and just take you somewhere that you've never been , you know , and naturally um never been . You know , and naturally um I was . You know , I don't want to say 11 , 12 . Um , I also remember . So that was like being exposed and and , and this will definitely age me , but hey got to embrace it . I mean that that nineties grunge um sound garden or Va nirvana they were .

Speaker 1 18:15

This was top 40 , this was on mtv , music videos , the radio itself , yeah , um , I remember uh neighbor buddy of mine . He and his brother started playing guitar and uh , I played for the first time . He taught me power chords , which you know , you . It's like a basic thing that you learn early on , but then , like you can play so much rock just from that , uh , at least like hang are there any particular or could describe that , if you don't mind , the power chords themselves .

Speaker 2 18:54

Um yeah , for anyone who doesn't understand kind of what they are .

Speaker 1 18:59

I mean when you hear that like like chugging guitar in a rock song . It's usually like a simple chord . That's also like very full .

Speaker 1 19:11

Okay , if that's a good way to describe it it sounds full because it has I'm gonna get technical , but like it's like got , you know , an octave and it's like the bait , it's like the deepest , bassiest part of the guitar . Okay , it fills , yeah , and it fits with a lot of music because it's simple . It doesn't use the third or the , you know , it just uses the fifth and the root note . Okay , basically , gotcha , so that makes it more open , okay .

Speaker 2 19:43

If you will , thanks for describing that , continue . You're talking about your neighbors , the guitars , so power chord .

Speaker 1 19:52

This is how you do it , and I learned glycerine by Bush , oh my gosh yeah yeah , it's like four , yeah , one , seven . I would have to play it , but yeah . So then I was like I remember going to summer camp , I think also , and like my , my buddies had a guitar and I was like there was a guitar class , um , and I learned some chord , regular chords , like open chords , uh-huh and um , and yeah , and also I was thinking about playing drums oh , dude , you were , yeah , you were forming a whole band yourself yeah , but , um , I think it worked out for the best , like I I , because I told my parents like I want to play drums , like absolutely not , uh , but guitar , fine .

Speaker 1 20:40

So , okay , they bought me a guitar and yeah , and then , like you could find chords and tabs online , like either whether you want to like just play the chords of the song and sing along , or you want to like play the lead guitar , like through the tab sheet . You know , um , and just start learning songs , gotcha , gotcha what was uh other than maybe like glycerine ?

Speaker 2 21:05

were there any uh earlier songs that kind of helped build ?

Speaker 1 21:10

you know your fundamentals uh , of either guitar or or piano , you know , or any other instrument itself I will say that , like learning the pentatonic scale , learning the like the basic guitar , blues , rock scale and lead guitar and improvisation was a huge step because I felt like , yeah , at my prime , like I like I felt just really good about that , you know , and I think that would lead later to being decent improv on piano when I kind of like returned back to it . But songs that I played gosh like yeah , I will say more like bands that later I was inspired by , were like the Killers , okay .

Speaker 2 22:05

Yeah , what I was inspired by were like the killers , okay , yeah , and like yeah like the early 2000s .

Speaker 1 22:08

I was like still into that , but I I just want to say I kind of fell off like guitar playing like um , I fell off in scene .

Speaker 1 22:19

I would say senior year of high school , going into college any particular reason and music fell off because at that point it's like all of a sudden you have to like pick a school and uh , or a profession , or like a next step , you know . So life , basically , yeah , like life and like , at that time the idea of music ever being anything more than just a hobby didn't exist yet , right . Right Um other than like , wouldn't it be cool ? But like yeah like the like , the inception of the dream didn't happen until later .

Speaker 2 22:52

So you were still , you were still . You still had that Aerosmith in your head . Man , that dream on .

Speaker 1 22:57

You know , dream on Right . Uh , I went to HF Festival . Okay , Like it was epic , it was Red Hot Chili Peppers closed it out . They had just released Californication . Oh , dude , there were bands like Live Offspring . That lineup was sick . Yeah , like it was like and that . And yeah , there was a radio station called HFS . Uh-huh and like yeah , and then it all changed .

Speaker 2 23:28

That was iconic . That festival was always very yeah .

Speaker 1 23:33

Once pop took over and then , like R&B , hip-hop took over , yeah , rock , essentially like died from the mainstream .

Speaker 2 23:49

But , and why do you say ? Why do you say that ? Do you feel like maybe it died , um , you know , in your perspective , or do you think it just died over overall ? And if so , what ? What was the death of it ? Was there something else that was to come after it ?

Speaker 1 24:08

Well , yeah , definitely . I mean it is an evolution and certainly on the mainstream radio doesn't mean that the industry itself didn't continue to grow .

Speaker 2 24:18

I like that . That's a good point actually .

Speaker 1 24:22

And certainly the age of the emo rock bands and my space , like that took over . I am not particularly into like , like . I feel like I like that like the later millennial . That's more , yeah , more grunge . Okay , that's my thing . But even though I like a lot of the songs and the music , but I was never like a huge fan I would say the killers are like the most millennial rock band .

Speaker 2 24:50

Okay , like , yeah , what do you think the difference ? What's the difference between emo and grunge ? Um , put you on the spot . Yeah , sorry .

Speaker 1 25:01

I mean like grunge is definitely like more . The lyrics , I think , are way more complex . And yeah , grunge like people , those guys are coming from a really dark place . You know , a lot of them were heroin addicts , a lot of them died , yeah , um , yeah . But there was just like this like deeper , like soul thing , I for me , whereas emo , yeah , it was more pop , it's more like , it's more , I agree , surface level and it appeals to like , it appealed to like young people like but not I don't think it had the like broad appeal that like a band like radiohead okay or led zeppelin .

Speaker 1 25:46

You know that like people still like listen to from all generations . Yeah , that there's a seriousness about the music .

Speaker 2 25:54

Um , a solemnness .

Speaker 1 25:58

Yeah , I could say yeah , right yeah , there's just like an energy to . I mean like , yeah , like a , like a song , but still like it's still like there's something empowering about it too . Yeah , for sure .

Speaker 2 26:11

So yeah , so what about ? I mean , I'm not sure if you were going to get to this or not , but you were in a college band at some point . I'm very interested to hear about this . How long did it last ? Um , you know how many people were in it ? Give me some . Give me some details on that .

Speaker 1 26:31

So it was , uh , it was college . Um , yeah , I was . I was in a fraternity house where there were there was definitely a spirit of independent thinking and interesting people and they threw cool parties with bands . It wasn't just basic stuff and the house was beautiful . This was at Cornell University .

Speaker 2 26:59

Oh , awesome .

Speaker 1 27:01

I think it was one of the most places and certainly a very like , prestigious , well-known place to get an education . Um , and so it was great . It was a great experience being there . What was your focus of study ? Hotel administration , oh , shoot .

Speaker 2 27:18

Okay , I went to their school for that .

Speaker 1 27:20

Yeah , yeah . So , um , it was my sophomore year . I believe yeah , soph believe yeah . Sophomore year , it was the end of the school

Making Music and Culinary Explorations

Speaker 1 27:29

year . It was like slope day , which is the big party day oh , shoot , okay , it's like the last day of classes and they have like big acts come in too . And kanye west came . Well , this is like before he really blew up . Okay , he was like on the way up , yeah , but like he was before , like graduation and stuff .

Speaker 1 27:49

It's like right around that , yeah , so , like , so , like I had never heard of him at that point , honestly , but like people that knew hip-hop did . But then obviously later everyone knows , yeah , yeah , um . So anyway , we were like the house was like right next to the slope too and we had like our own party . That was like happening throughout the day before like the headliner comes on outside and wait .

Speaker 2 28:17

They call it the slope . Is it like a hill ? It's a giant hill .

Speaker 1 28:20

Okay , yeah , all right , and so like the students take over the hill . The bottom of the hill is like the stage um , and back then it was like byob and kind of like chaotic , and eventually the universities all started getting tougher and tougher on alcohol yeah , um yeah but yeah , it's hazing and whatnot started to become a yeah , yeah , for sure , um , so so yeah anyway um , I know , right , you can get lost as you speak about it , right ?

Speaker 2 28:53

It makes you kind of reminisce about the times and the things that you've , you've been through , but um what ? What instrument did you ? Did you end up playing in the band itself ?

Speaker 1 29:04

So anyway , yeah , I know , I went on a tangent , but um , it was slope day , right ? Oh yeah , slope day .

Speaker 2 29:11

Let's get back on the slopes , put your skis on .

Speaker 1 29:13

I yeah , I was like jamming with some guys that were really good at guitar . There was a drummer in the house , Um , and we just started jamming and we learned a couple rock songs , including Freebird , by the way .

Speaker 2 29:27

I can just hear you right now like is there a drummer in the house ? Excuse me , Is there a drummer in the house .

Speaker 1 29:35

I believe in playing Freebird .

Speaker 2 29:36

Yes , I believe in .

Speaker 1 29:38

Freebird ? I think we all do I think we have to embrace it . So yeah , we learned Freebirdbird . I think I learned a sublime song , okay I remember which , what I got , possibly okay .

Speaker 1 29:52

And there's one more . It was like rolling stones , maybe jumping jack , flash , okay , okay . So it was those three songs and , like I prefer , I was singing too , I sang and I played guitar , so it was . There was bass player , but it was two guitarists I sang and played rhythm , and a drummer and I like gave it my all , like I was like as you should , I was rolling on the floor like soloing , like I was possessed , you know what dude , sometimes that's what it ?

Speaker 1 30:22

takes to play Freebird , I was possessed and um and the the crowd there . It wasn't like a huge crowd , but like there was enough people there . It's like , yeah , it's slope day and like they were like what crazy it was . Just like I'm like going back like I was like , and then afterwards like wait a second , like I , like I can do this .

Speaker 2 30:44

I can do this right . And then Kanye West shows up .

Speaker 1 30:48

Yeah , no , he didn't show up . I did see him play . Oh , that's cool , especially at that time too , right ? Snoop Dogg was my senior year .

Speaker 2 30:57

Oh , so we're talking about like yeah , they had big acts coming through Cornell knew what they were doingnell knew what they

Speaker 1 31:03

were doing . They had big acts and they have . They have money for sure , yeah , um , but yeah , I mean , the important thing is like , yeah , like I played in . So then senior year , junior senior year , I played in rock bands . Okay , so you continue to play . And then , yeah , and then senior year is when we have like the most consistent band . We were called dripping wheel . I mainly played guitar and sang and we had a bass player , a drummer , um , and what did you just play ?

Speaker 2 31:28

it Did you play at house parties , did you play like open mics ? Where ? Where were you ? You know , where'd you get some of your exposure during that , that , that senior year ?

Speaker 1 31:36

We played at some house parties and then there was a , a place called the nines , by the way , oh , a place called the nines , by the way .

Speaker 2 31:44

Oh nice , um yeah , so did that inspire your name at all .

Speaker 1 31:46

It was like a yes in a way . Okay , so let's go with yes yes , that's a short answer . Um yeah , like it was good , like we played a lot of classic rock stuff , like fun , like party classic rock and people were into it , like it was , it was a good time .

Speaker 2 32:06

There's some songs that I'm sure you know you grow up with too , that you're like man . I like I would always love to be able to play this track . You know , and I'm sure there were , you know , some songs like that that kind of influenced you . And then , I'm sure , once you learn to play those tracks and and are able to do it in front of an audience and you get particular reactions from them , that makes you feel like you , uh , yeah , take me take me to that after that senior year and what happened ?

Speaker 2 32:48

because you know , obviously you , either you know you either graduate and move on , or or you know you kind of you know you , you know how . There's those guys , there's guys that kind of linger around college for a few years yeah no , I didn't do that .

Speaker 1 33:03

I mean , everyone like moved on . I ended up getting a job first in ireland , oh wow , and then in california wait .

Speaker 2 33:11

What was your job in ?

Speaker 1 33:13

ireland . So I worked at a hotel , okay , all right , that was your major , I was basically . I was basically like it was like a work , it was like a I would call it like an intern Study abroad type thing . Yeah , I mean actually . Yeah , I got paid Like there was . At the time I thought there was potential for like a longer term thing . But I should have known better , because there's like an expiration on the visa . Okay , and like they have to , like really make a case for you .

Speaker 2 33:38

Yeah .

Speaker 1 33:38

At the time , if they like , wanted to like , keep you in the country , of course . And that's I mean , that's even still a thing now yeah , yeah , it's hard to work in europe as an american . Yeah , um , which is why , yeah , I've been pursuing the dual citizenship thing in romania , which which , yeah , I know that's like a whole conversation possibly yeah , um but I I guess , yeah , to wrap up the post-college experience , yeah , like it was hotel industry jobs , I tried actually to get a band going in California .

Speaker 1 34:14

I had a buddy at Berkeley who was a good guitar player .

Speaker 2 34:18

Now were you talking about .

Speaker 1 34:19

Berkeley , the school of music . I was talking about Berkeley , california , gotcha . Yes , you know . There talking about Berkeley , california . Gotcha , yeah , okay , you know there's also a Berkeley , okay , yeah , so yeah , good clarifying point . So yeah , I lived in Sonoma , which was close to , uh , close enough to Oakland or Berkeley , or yeah , I think the city is also Berkeley , yes , I don't know why my mind's going here , but um uh , in ireland , what was your role in the hotel itself ?

Speaker 1 34:47

just curious . So I started off as , like , an assistant manager , but they quickly realized I didn't know what I was doing . I don't think , because , like at cornell , they teach you how to be like a ceo but they don't teach you how to like the small stuff maybe it's like , you understand concepts and strategy , but like how to use those concepts and the everyday um .

Speaker 2 35:10

I think that's where more of uh experience yeah comes from right .

Speaker 1 35:15

It's just that hand , I didn't have that hands-on gotcha like food and beverage experience , like restaurants and stuff um , and I will say , though , the best thing I learned at cornell was we had culinary classes mandatory oh cool , yeah , dig a little so I learned how to cook at university . Oh , cool and um , it's since been like a lifelong I didn't know that passion and I was . I don't want to say passion , but I want to say like , like , yeah , I would say passion , it's a thing that I it's like everyday thing , you know , like what's your favorite meal to cook , like like .

Speaker 2 35:51

if you were to cook the crew here a meal and you know we wouldn't have any say in what it would be , what would you cook ?

Speaker 1 36:01

Yeah , probably do like a Mediterranean vibe , vibe like greek kind of greek italian spread . I think I would do something like that . You know , maybe some , yeah , mediterranean all around . Yeah , maybe some like middle eastern flair um , I would go there , yeah , I yeah .

Speaker 2 36:24

All different kind of eclectic flavors and gosh , I mean I'm sure we could talk about that forever .

Speaker 1 36:33

No , I feel like , yeah , it's typically like what I make consistently and I feel like I'm pretty good at that region of food .

Speaker 2 36:42

So then , why don't you tell me a little bit uh , let's , let's go a little , we're going chronological here , okay , so yeah , give me a little bit with what uh happened after maybe the , uh , the study abroad and then uh , yeah , so yeah , after work abroad in ireland .

Speaker 1 36:58

I mean , I took my guitar and like a little tiny like amp , so I wasn't really doing much there with music . Wait , you brought your guitar , though , with you . I just brought my electric guitar , yeah . Oh cool , like thinking it could be a thing you know , yeah , um well , that's a big commitment to bring a guitar with you , you know abroad . You say that yeah .

Speaker 1 37:18

So , um , but it did open my , opened my eyes to like europe and life . I mean ireland's its own little thing , but , yeah , certainly like different right . Yeah , uh , in a lot of ways . Um , at that time ireland was very global too . Ireland was booming , so people from all over europe were there gotcha um , so it's cool to be . I was the only american working at that hotel and just met a lot of cool people from spain , poland , hungary , um , all over , yeah , so , uh , it was a good time , yeah , and I'm sure maybe what being the only american as well was uh , maybe a challenge as well .

Speaker 2 37:57

What ? What about uh ? Like any language , uh barriers itself or ?

Speaker 1 38:03

no barriers . I mean they have their own slang , which ? Is like was kind of fun to learn and figure out .

Speaker 2 38:07

But yeah , no language issues in ireland gotcha , yeah so let's see here , um gosh , you know to , to go from there . Um , you know , I know we were talking about earlier kind of uh , let's see here having like a flow , state , state , let's kind of shift , let's shift gears a little bit , you know , and with not just passions , with you know music and whatnot . But I know you said that you used to surf and stuff and possibly even still do Tell me and stuff , and possibly even still do tell me , you know , how did you know the love of those things kind of , um , you know intertwine with your music and maybe kind of like you know sidetrack to like life itself and maybe some of the lessons that you kind of had to learn , you know , alongside , uh , you know , not just learning the music itself but kind of life itself .

Speaker 1 39:07

Yeah , I think and this is the thing that , as far as music production goes , that I struggled with for the longest time , still do to some degree , but I think I overcame the initial challenge , um locks that kept me from doing anything more than just dabbling in a studio . Um , and yeah , I think that came from . Yeah , life like , like and yeah , I know we switch gears but , like you know , fast forward life takes over . Music is nothing more than a hobby . Um , at one point I did and I think this important because I think this all ties it together I tried being a saint

Navigating Electronic Music Production Journeys

Speaker 1 39:52

. I moved back here . I had my life in california fell apart in the span of like a weekend . Like busted . My shoulder snowboarding girlfriend broke up with me who I was living with , okay and um , and got laid off oh , dude , the trifecta , trifecta , the three gosh the three things .

Speaker 1 40:13

But it was a sign . All right , like I'm at a restart I'm gone .

Speaker 1 40:16

So I moved back home to baltimore , started over um , but yeah , like since I've been back here , in the beginning I was actually trying to make it as like a singer , songwriter , but my vocals like just didn't have the chops . It was like different . I wasn't dedicating to the art form , like looking back , I was just showing up and thinking I could pull that off . Yeah , like behind a band I think I was able to , but like , just like purely off the caliber of my voice . So that was like a big failure because at that point , like the dream was kind of dead okay how long ago was this ?

Speaker 1 40:54

well , you know this was like this was like over 10 years ago now , but then eventually it kind of got me on this electronic music path .

Speaker 2 41:03

Yeah yeah , dig into that a little bit , because that is kind of how I learned about you and kind of seeing your name in the electronic DJ scene in Baltimore and I knew you were doing shows all over the place . I do remember seeing your name . Yeah , all over the place .

Speaker 2 41:26

And I know you were probably doing weddings and stuff like that just to probably bring you know some some money in and whatnot . But uh , yeah , dig a little bit into like that transition of how you then became um more of an electronic uh producer , producer , engineer itself yeah , so I did also like .

Speaker 1 41:51

one thing that happened in the 2000s was I I like fell in love with electronic music , like old school tiesto , um that like old school trans . There's something epic about it . I had some incredible experiences , uh , as a young lad , like in clubs in new york and um the hamptons , and like my cousin like would take me these places , and it opened , blew my mind , opened my eyes to this whole new thing . And this was before edm really blew up and became commercial as we know it today . Yeah , so yeah , I started dabbling . Also , I had a buddy , craig , who sadly passed away a couple years ago . Sorry to hear that , yeah , and he's a big part of this story too , and I was thinking about him a lot the other day .

Speaker 2 42:42

Do me a favor , look up . Yeah , say hi to Craig . There's a camera up there . You see that one right there . Yeah , say hi to craig . There's a camera up there . You see that one right there what's up ? Craig what's saying hi yeah yeah , yeah , it's important to think about things like that , though I'm sorry . I'm sorry that you had to go through that , but , um , you know what ? Uh , what did you maybe learn from from that ? Or yeah , we were .

Speaker 1 43:02

We started dabbling in like music stuff , like beat making . He was really into gear and um , kind of like pushing me a lot like was he older than you no same age .

Speaker 1 43:17

We were friends from high school , gotcha , um , so , yeah , um , we were . He like pushed me to get into Ableton , okay , um , which is a program , which is the program that I use now and I love . You know there's there's others that people love Um , but yeah , he was really influential early on in like getting me involved with music production and he was a dj like . He was used to dj like back in the like early 2000s . 1722 oh , legendary , yeah , like after hours club in baltimore and in the heyday , oh , yeah , um , iconic , so yeah what did he have ?

Speaker 2 44:03

what was his dj name ? Do you do you know craig james ?

Speaker 1 44:06

okay , which is a good , good like house , yeah , for sure absolutely , um , so yeah , anyway . Um , I know we were talking about , yeah , the path towards that , so it started for me in production , but it was dabbling , a lot of dabbling , and I kept trying to like do different things with it . I had all these good ideas , but I never took them beyond like a basic loop or like musical idea .

Speaker 2 44:37

So most of your ideas kind of started , though , like on the MIDI , like on like a keyboard itself or like , um , let me , let me think about how . I want to ask you this question uh , was there any live instrumentation that you incorporated , like guitar or or piano , in the very beginning , or was it mostly like , um , you know kind of , uh , let's see your , I guess , a midi setup where you know you're just kind of directing samples and whatnot . In the beginning it was actually more live .

Speaker 1 45:12

Okay , which is interesting , because now I'm kind of coming back to that yeah , we'll definitely get to that for sure , because I want to talk to you about that , but I think that resulted in some stuckness . Stuckness , yeah , a lot of stuckness , stickiness , yeah , a lot of like reasons why I can't move forward , and it's like oh , I don't have this , like mic or compressor , preamp or listen , you know what wait let's knowledge of mixing let's tell the people like , listen , if you're stuck , don't get sticky .

Speaker 2 45:44

All right , there's going to be something that's going to try and hold you back . There's going to be something that's going to try and keep you where you're at . But I think Neil is making a great point here . Don't let anything small like that , whether it's a piece of equipment or an instrument itself , don't let that hold you back . Yeah , continue for sure .

Speaker 1 46:11

And and um , have you ever read the war of art by steven pressfield ?

Speaker 2 46:16

yes , actually he talks about the resistance .

Speaker 1 46:19

So it's that right , it's , the resistance is reasons why we can't move forward . And so you asked about the flow state . I just hadn't really got there . I hadn't got to that point where I was ever in it . It just felt like this thing I needed to do , but couldn't you could see it in the distance , yeah . I couldn't pull it through until I later decided I was going to really go for it full time .

Speaker 1 46:46

And this was after I decided to learn how to DJ , going gung-ho , and started getting gigs from DJing so yeah , and and one thing you and I have talked about his accountability yeah , and this is when I started working with a producer friend , heath Allen , and you'll see many of my early tracks he is on and involved in Okay , and he built this really nice studio at his apartment and I was going there during COVID Like he was like my COVID friend .

Speaker 2 47:19

This is in Baltimore . Yeah , this is in Baltimore , gotcha .

Speaker 1 47:24

You know , and we were working on music . Okay , you know , and he didn't have a ton of production experience , but he had a lot of experience as a dj and understood edm , understood festivals you know way more than I did . So , um , it was great in terms of , like , having somewhere to go consistently and having someone else to do it with . You know , I think one thing that's challenging is doing it alone , and when you can bring people in too . Yeah , there's this new collaboration flow state also , for sure Happens , but , yeah , I found myself getting to the point where I could really get in the zone for several hours at a time , yeah , and just just be dialed in .

Speaker 2 48:12

Focus , stay focused , and uh , yeah , really kind of , um , you know , get uh in in the moment I guess , uh , you know , with , with the music making itself and so so . So tell me a little bit more . Uh , you said Heath Allen was his name .

Speaker 1 48:29

Yeah .

Speaker 2 48:30

Maybe what were some of the things that you learned from him at the time . If you could dig a little bit that helped you then kind of develop the DJ and engineering and production side that you have now . Yeah .

Speaker 1 48:50

I mean , he helped us get some like good vocals early , which is important , obviously . And yeah , just like getting over the hump for a few tracks and having someone to do it with . Yeah , and we went through a lot of growing pains in being on the same page and also in working with mix engineers , and that was we talk about stuckness and things that get in the way . Well , yeah , it's like oh , this idea of mixing and mastering is daunting .

Speaker 2 49:21

I know right .

Speaker 1 49:22

Or it's expensive , or you send it off to someone and then they send you something back and like you're not satisfied . And then send it off to someone and then they send you something back and like you're not satisfied , and then there's like back and forth , and yeah , there was a lot of that too and I started to ask myself like I think I have to like learn mixing . I gotta learn how to mix , I gotta learn how to master even if it's not like perfect , like can I get it good enough ?

Speaker 1 49:47

so I I got out of that idea of being precious about everything . Oh , I like that , got me gets , got me so stuck early and often was that , yeah , that feeling of perfection , that feeling of like oh , let's redo this . Well , this is better , you know , um , yeah , so fast forward to like recently and today , and the most flow that I think I've been in in a certain way is the three-day challenge .

Speaker 2 50:16

The three-day songwriting production .

Speaker 1 50:19

Start-to-finish challenge oh shoot , okay , which changed everything , honestly .

Speaker 2 50:23

Really so . Tell me a little more about this . I'm intrigued , really , so tell me a little more about this . I'm intrigued , yeah .

Speaker 1 50:29

So I have this accountability group , which is good because Solo , it just helps me . Where are these other guys from ? They're from New York and LA , so one of them lives in New York , one in LA , and how did you find them ? So we met through the Hyperbits Academy alumni alumni group . Okay , and what is hyper bits ? Hyper bits is an online music production school , okay , um , so it was like the second program I like signed up for hyper , hyper bits .

Speaker 2 51:02

Yeah , okay , he's also an artist . Oh cool , okay , yeah , I'll do .

Speaker 1 51:06

I'll do a little , he also helped me uh get signed to my first label .

Speaker 2 51:10

So and who was that ? Who's the label ?

Speaker 1 51:13

uh , as you are . Oh cool , instead of new york . So I had a track called whispers this past year . Oh cool , excuse me , get signed yeah nice . Yeah , that's always a goal right of of uh , anybody definitely , definitely , yeah , definitely when , when you yeah , you get some validation that someone else likes your music .

Speaker 2 51:34

It's not like just you yeah , it's really , and it's not just your friends , they like your music um , tell me , tell me , let's go back to the three-day um challenge . Yeah , I'd love , I'd like , to hear a little bit on like maybe like break each day down and kind of you know what you were able to learn and take from that and and why you know it was monumental in in your uh career yeah , I was , I think , when I first got here , when I mentioned like prince , like finishing a song in a day , um , and actually Hyperbits the school , like that was like .

Speaker 1 52:08

The first thing he says is like this idea that you can make a track in eight hours . You know that , even one day , you know . And he was faced with deadlines and professional producers , sometimes that work for labels , sometimes they got to just like pump stuff out . So , yeah , this idea that it was possible to do it in one day has always been on my mind . I love that .

Three-Day Music Production Challenge Insights

Speaker 1 52:33

So I was talking to the guys and and like we ended up with three days is like okay , three days you can like still kind of live your life . Like obviously you want to carve some time out more than you normally would , but like you don't have to like completely abandon all other responsibilities , yeah , yeah , we have to also think about , like you know , like having a job or a family or you know all these other things so yeah have to be realistic about the goals

Speaker 1 53:03

themselves too yeah , so you know we had these three days . Yeah , we all had like more or less some stuff .

Speaker 2 53:09

I had like a gig one of the days , but it wasn't like three gig days , right did you get to pick the three days , or did it kind of just like come up you know out of nowhere like okay , hey , today is the three-day challenge oh , we know , we , we like talked about it and agreed on this was this would work for all of us , gotcha .

Speaker 1 53:31

So so , yeah , we .

Speaker 1 53:35

and what's great is like JJ , one of the guys like he's so like he works for meta , like on the ad side for Facebook and stuff like really smart dude and like spreadsheets and like plans and like numbers , projections , yeah he was doing all that and and um , yeah , it was cool because he's he's very good about like , and that's why it's good to have these people that you set goals with that can challenge your goals and ask questions he's just very good about all of that and they're , I feel like something that's super helpful with that is the fact that they are in a whole different universe themselves .

Speaker 2 54:15

So , you know , maybe they have a different point of focus throughout the challenge itself . Or , you know , maybe they want to see something different in themselves throughout that challenge . So , in turn , it helps them bring that out of you . You know as well and , like you were talking , you know he has just back to JJ , you know , with like spreadsheets and whatnot . You know it probably gave him a different mindset of how . You know , you know how to achieve these goals and in it , you know , in order to be able to achieve those goals , you know , you know doing it in a different way and then you're kind of bringing you in and vice versa .

Speaker 1 55:00

Yeah , for sure . I mean that's why yeah , it's good to have people that and I think it's like I remember when I worked in corporate , like you set goals formally and there's a process and there's learning around how to set good goals and there's really a lot of focus on on goal setting and performance and how to get the most out of people and um , but then it's like , yeah , looking at yourself , how do I get the most out of myself ?

Speaker 2 55:24

And that's a great point dude I .

Speaker 2 55:25

I sorry to interrupt you with that because this is really important and something I want to dig on at some point in a different episode yards , you know . Think about , like if it was a thousand yards , you know , like how many goals or how many you know field goals , slash touchdowns , uh would be scored . It would probably be one of the lowest scoring games ever . So you really do have to . You know how . You know how much time and dedication is going to go into you realizing that it needs to be a hundred , a hundred yards , you know , I think it's really important and I love that you mentioned that .

Speaker 2 56:13

I'm going to really put some time in it and thought and attention into that .

Speaker 1 56:17

So the biggest thing I got out of the , from a goal setting standpoint , from this three day challenge , it changed my big goal , it changed the , the division for every , every , for the music and for my life like in a lot of ways , like and when I say change , a lot of things just kind of shifted . But yeah , it made me realize that a I could do this like and like really good stuff comes out when you like force that to happen , cause you get that deep work and like a deep sense of um connection to the track , like like when you work on a track here and there , an hour here and there , it's like , it's like you're not building that bond .

Speaker 2 57:03

Yeah , there's a touch .

Speaker 1 57:04

Yeah , yeah , so so , yeah , anyway , um , yeah , it , there's a touch . Yeah , yeah , so so , yeah , anyway , um , yeah , it changed how I saw the vision for my music , the sound and like the whole thing , because it forced me to write and sing and perform and like believe in myself in all of those areas again . But now , with the newfound production , knowledge and prowess , um , and the help of , like all the learning and all the coaches , like I feel like my , my skills are like getting to the point where I'm really like feeling strongly about that . But now to bring in this like new vision for the music , that it's no longer me as this DJ producer model in the EDM industry , as this , like now it's this hybrid electronic rock artist that's in its own thing . Yeah , you know , kind of like . Yeah , like Nine Inch Nails was Like even like Radiohead or even like so we'll see Like I could see a band forming from it , this new thing . But at the same time , right now , I want to cultivate everything creatively and give it space to grow and not force it . Oh , yeah , love that .

Speaker 1 58:35

So I'm wrapping up my Berlin album , which has taken , of course , a lot longer than I thought it would . Sometimes it does . But it just like you know , it goes through iterations and I'm trying to tell a story and now I feel like I'm in the best position to tell that story and to go from like pure , like house music , techno , you know , edm , artist , and then fuse it with the new rock , electronic stuff and build that bridge through the album , through the ep , and it's , it's happening . So each like song has both a like four to the floor beat , electronic groove part , you know , house track or techno track , but also has this like interlude that's either rock or cinematic or orchestral .

Speaker 1 59:30

I have a viola player . Oh cool , yeah , so it's . It's pretty cool .

Speaker 2 59:35

Yeah , a bunch of different accompaniment . I guess you could say with that . Let me ask you the the three day challenge Was there a specific track that that came out of , that that maybe people can possibly uh , listen to , or so what's ?

Speaker 1 59:53

what's interesting is is , yeah , the I really thought I was gonna start to finish and release a track , okay , but the track ended up being so different and unique and got me thinking in this new way that I and I have this other music that I'm excited to release , that's been done and feel like progresses me as an artist , shows the progression . And this track then comes along after the Berlin project Gotcha .

Speaker 2 1:00:27

I really feel like it has to fit there yeah , gotcha , do you have a specific uh time period ? Uh , when you feel like this berlin um album slash , um , uh , let's see , here project is going to be coming out or uh is . Is it kind of still in the works , or how you ?

Speaker 1 1:00:47

know I told myself , like absolute cutoff is end of the year , like I can't touch it , I can't touch it in 2025 . Okay , so , whatever state it's in um in the next month , month and a half , like it's gotta go out .

Speaker 1 1:01:01

Yeah , so you're setting goals like kind of yeah , it just has to , because I've really I want the new year to be about , yeah , about me as this hybrid vocal guitar , piano , electronic artist you know , Making like just real shit you know , yeah , for sure , dude , like real music , that got me excited . Yeah , you know , and I feel like , yeah , I , I all the , all the stuff I've been making has been good , but like this is now like it feels right , like inside greatness man , yeah like from the soul like it feels right and and I needed to go through all of that development .

Speaker 1 1:01:51

You know all of those trials and tribulations and uncertainties , and obviously there's still plenty of that . But , um , to kind of find that new , I don't know it's like a new set of like . I've been playing video games again . I like didn't , I didn't play them for a long time yeah .

Speaker 1 1:02:12

And like how far they like that feeling of adventure and like you get this new plate of armor , you get this new like level up , like maybe you've been through like a tough boss and kind of beat up , right , you're kind of like , but then things are hanging off of you , you know , and then it's like oh , you get like to the new thing , and then everything gets like put on and you get all the like new shit , yeah , like all right , refreshed , yeah .

Speaker 2 1:02:36

So that's how I see yourself , you know , maybe moving in the future and kind of building in a different location , or is Baltimore , you know ?

Speaker 1 1:03:09

or is you know ? Are you set in stone to be something here ? Yeah , so this is a tough one for me because I would like to see myself somewhere else . I do have family and my mom that I have some responsibility for . She's much older , helping her out with a lot of things like physically , yeah , um , so there is that , but there's other help too . So , you know , and there's my dj career here , kind of holding me here . At the same time , I've been making inroads and exploring Europe , as a possible second home at least , and I think where I can land is seasonal , at least for now , where I'd like to , can I , can I get a seasonal location where I can , yeah , start to build , plant some seeds and build somewhere else as well , but maintain perhaps peak season here for my business as a dj ? Um , and make sure , yeah , like I'm not completely like abandoning , you know , yeah , uh , family um , any particular city uh in in the united states .

Speaker 1 1:04:22

Uh , you know that you could kind of foresee yourself , maybe like one or two or I I only went to nashville once , but there was something about nashville , um , hanging out with songwriters and , and you know you , you could rent a house with other songwriters . It's like affordable , like it's pretty , like it's way more chill than like la or new york , and it's yeah , it's like more , it seems like that . Or New York , and it's yeah , it's like more . It seems like that city is more really about the music and you know there's still plenty of like ego stuff and obviously country is like king there . But yeah , there's something about that place that , um , I'm very interested to explore more . Yeah , I at least like just the idea of just being around people that are songwriters and and talent like that , um , there seems good for me , seems fit . Yeah , and it's not like , it's not like incredibly far like LA , um , but New York , too , like is right within an earshot .

Speaker 1 1:05:31

So for sure and I do have family connections there and um one of my like friends and advisor , kind of someone I confide in a lot who's in the film industry . You know he's been helping me think about this too .

Speaker 2 1:05:47

And strategizing , yeah , new york it's cool that you have someone else to kind of , you know , bounce ideas off with and uh you know use as a helpful reminder as to you know , to , to , to do these things and kind of , you know , help you , you know , stay at the forefront of growth and change . So that's pretty cool that you have that .

Speaker 1 1:06:08

And I think , now that I'm going in a more rock direction , new York now makes way more sense . So when do you ?

Speaker 2 1:06:16

decide , you know , when do you decide that that is your the next , you know , I mean , just with what we were talking about earlier , you know , making sure that we're , you know , accountable and kind earlier . You know , making sure that we're , you know , accountable and kind of you know , finally , actually deciding like this is what is best for me , you know , is there a particular timeline that occurs that helps you understand ? Like , okay , now is the time to move , and I think this is good for our viewers too , to kind of help them think about maybe some of the , some of the things that they are kind of teetering in between . You know , do they go ? It's , it's almost like a fork in the road , right ?

Speaker 2 1:06:59

It's like do you go left , do you go right or do you even kind of you take the the ?

Speaker 1 1:07:12

the road less traveled , yeah , so one piece of advice I got was along the lines to just go all in on the new thing . Yeah , one thing I've been like yeah , in my mind and I feel like this has been something . How do I like be all things you know , and I think that can be like how do I ? I'm still neil nines , but I'm thinking about this new brand Like that's tough Cause . I feel I really want , I really want a musical identity that's sounds more like a band name , that isn't like a dj , a person , a producer , um , who's like sole musical focus perhaps is now this new thing .

Speaker 1 1:07:42

Yeah , right that's how I would oops , sorry about that before mike's dead , or mike r anyway . Um , yeah , so it was cool . Actually , the way I just described that , uh was probably the best way I've ever described that , like how I envision that .

Speaker 2 1:08:09

So that's helped me think through that . So thank you , it's good to , it's good to think about that helping me think through no problems of things . You know we we've had so many good conversations about um , about this kind of stuff yeah about life and uh , I mean I , I met uh ne , I'd say maybe actually we were a part of a community online called the Indie Music Academy .

Speaker 1 1:08:36

Yes , yes .

Speaker 2 1:08:36

And what's the gentleman who Ryan , yes , ryan , holiday yeah .

Speaker 1 1:08:44

Sorry if I got your name . I know it's Ryan . I know it's .

Speaker 2 1:08:46

Ryan , I would like to actually , I'll probably include a link in the description so you can check his . So , in searching for a community itself to be a part of and to try and hold us accountable to all these different things , we found something called the Indie Music Academy and , yeah , ryan's doing a lot for independent artists and helping them understand how to really blossom into the artists that they are today . And we were a part of that community at first and I saw his name and Neil's name and I'm like man , that looks familiar . And then we went to a , um , a community uh building workshop at a lineup room studios which was held by uh MC bravado and uh Brandon Lackey , there on Saratoga street and uh , yeah , I , I remember you know he introduced him to me and I'm like , wait a second .

Speaker 2 1:09:50

Uh , you know , we were a part of the same uh community , right , and uh , there was you know that's small to more uh for you and uh , I do remember kind of like , you know , meeting you there and then kind of doing a little bit of research on you and remember seeing your name , you know , as far as shows go , and you were doing weddings and things like that , and then I started digging into some of your music and , yeah , man , let me tell you it was very well put together and you are consistently releasing music and uh , that got me into , uh , you know , working with you and so you know we have a few tracks in the work works now and uh , I could foresee us , you know , working on stuff . Uh , for , for the prolonged future .

Speaker 1 1:10:44

Yeah , I think , working with you on the

Exploring Musical Identity and Future Vision

Speaker 1 1:10:48

track . It was interesting because at that time I was , I think , struggling with this idea that and you hear this advice a lot in house music or dance music is really to be in a certain niche and really go all in on that .

Speaker 2 1:11:05

Yeah .

Speaker 1 1:11:05

And it makes sense actually why ? So I think it is good advice for most producers , but I think for me it just never really fit enough because , yeah , each song I just wanted to like build off itself and , yeah , the song to write itself , not my vision of like what it , what it needed to be .

Speaker 2 1:11:29

Yeah , you don't want to put yourself in a box , right ?

Speaker 2 1:11:31

So so , finding a niche is is , is is a challenge , right ? Because if you're ever evolving and always growing , you know how do you , you know , get comfortable in one particular spot when you know that there's places you know around that particular spot that are also possibly going to be comfortable , or even more comfortable than the spot that you're in ? So , yeah , you know , finding that niche itself , you know itself , uh , you know were you able to do that , or do you feel like you are still kind of you know um , you're molding that itself ?

Speaker 1 1:12:15

I think this is where the new vision for like the hybrid electronic music , like rock artist , I think moby is a good . Oh yeah , moby is a good archetype in a way . Um , not that it's gonna like sound like him , but yeah , the way that he like fused it all together , yeah , um , the different pieces to create like a sonic . You know scope as an individual artist , but it's still kind of in this electronic camp in a way yeah , I love the way you put that .

Speaker 2 1:12:47

Um , what about like somebody ? Like the gorillas kind of , maybe too ?

Speaker 1 1:12:51

right , yeah , even even like Lincoln park to some degree , like they're like more like more squarely band . But nine inch nails , certainly , yeah , yeah , I think like so that that outside of the traditional , again like EDM , usb stick , dj , I just felt it was a blessing to skies that I started to be like I don't know if I'm really . I started not believing myself that I was going to make it in this industry anymore and then I was like well , of course not , cuz like I'm not , I'm not as all-in as like I am on this of course so it was a huge awakening and it was just so many blessings , you know , to get me to that point yeah .

Speaker 1 1:13:44

I think , being in Berlin last year , coming back like everything started to change , I think , from being there to coming back , um , how so that would like form inside or mentally getting cold out there , huh I knew right , that's why I'm doing it .

Speaker 2 1:14:02

would it be ? Would it be more mentally ? Uh , the change is occurring like inside , or like , um , you know what about ? Like physically too , you know , I mean , um , give me a little bit of like , how , you know you can , let's see here , um , you know you can , shape yourself around , change um itself , and you know , I know it's probably , it's , it's a little bit scary . Uh , you know we're , we're creatures of habit too , right ? So any type of change is , is is a challenge , um , but um , how do you foresee yourself , uh , you know , um tackling that challenge itself ?

Speaker 1 1:14:43

Yeah , I think , I think I'm at a uh , it sounds like you are too from . You know we're at a pivotal crossroads and wanting a bigger change For me . I want a bigger change in , like my operating system , like how I go about the day , yeah , and even like we've talked a lot about health and wellness previously and I know that was a topic to bring up today I think , yeah , like how do I be the best version of myself that can execute on this new vision ? The best and this new vision is an opportunity to remake other parts of my life . Not that I like health and wellness haven't been important to me and I haven't haven't like I , you know , exercise , I sleep , you know I try to prioritize sleep Um 80 , 20, . My diet tends to be good , but , like now , it's like next level . You know I want the next level of that Um , and and now is the opportune time for that .

Speaker 2 1:15:46

Yeah .

Speaker 2 1:15:47

I love that man it's cool to hear and to see .

Speaker 2 1:15:53

And on this show I try and focus on self-awareness and the trajectory that we're going in and not just kind of taking the bow and arrow and just shooting it anywhere . But you know we're we're trying to aim in a particular direction that we , that we know that , uh , you know we should be going or that we're destined to go in . You know , and , uh , I can definitely see you know you all the things that you talked about with you know , from the accountability to the flow state itself . You know , to the growth and the . You know the understanding of all the different instruments , the instrumentation that you've taken under your wing . You know it's really cool to be able to see , you know , know other artists who are really focused on the future and it seems like you're always kind of thinking about the , the next step . Yeah , you know , you're always thinking about where you're going to be in the future and how you're also gonna kind of gonna fit into that as well um yeah , you know , do you foresee any ?

Speaker 2 1:17:11

um , let's see here , are you scared at all of of the future and and and and what it holds ? And not just like in a worldly manner ? Because I I kind of like how we just this conversation really focused on the bubble , this bubble that that you're in , because we're all in our own bubble , you know , and we don't really get to . You know , I mean we can visually on , like social media , see what other people's bubbles like , but to really get to , like hear what's inside your bubble , is really cool , you know , and I think it's really informational and educational for other people .

Speaker 2 1:17:48

But do you foresee any challenges or are you scared at all for what the future holds itself ?

Speaker 1 1:17:57

I wouldn't say I'm scared . It's like I think AI and as obviously music stuff it has potential , I think that even lends itself more to the need to really go deeper as an artist and make authentic , like good ass music . Yes , um , because they , I think ai is more likely to get okay and good at making basic shit . You know , and I agree I don't see it going much deeper , um , but either way , I think people want to identify with the human artist and so from that front , you know , I think about like something to be afraid of . I , I don't know , I remain . You know things could always get weird again , they're more likely to get weird . You know weird stuff is going to happen , but we all seem to just kind of like carry on . So what can we do you ?

Speaker 1 1:18:58

know , other than be . You know , I think about this like is it more , is it better to be like ignorant and happy ? You know , to some degree there , you know I think about this like is it more ? Is it better to be like ignorant and happy ? You know , to some degree there . You know , um , I love that .

Speaker 1 1:19:13

With regards to like yeah , certain things out of our control ignorant and happy , as opposed to well , yeah , I don't , I don't know that I'm not saying like better to be ignorant and happy versus like caring about all things and taking on the burdens of all of civilization On your shoulders , on your own shoulders . Yeah , knowing like . Yeah , like the world , the messed up stuff is going on , and what do we know ? Yeah , the world , the messed up stuff is going on , and what do we know ? You know who you know . There's different sides to different stories and , um , so , from all that perspective , I , I think I'm pretty Zen like or Buddhist like , in a way that , yeah , I don't , I don't , I don't burden myself too much , even though I try to remain someone who's knowledgeable about perspectives and events and things like that , at least major stuff .

Speaker 2 1:20:23

Are there any ? Let's see here . Are there any like podcasts or artists that we should maybe listen to , or artists that we should maybe kind of look out for in the future ? And even , you know , is there anything other than the Berlin Project or anything that you kind of want to highlight , uh , of your own music , uh , that I know that was a multifaceted question there , but just kind of want you to be able to kind of give , uh , some of the listeners maybe some some stuff to to either do homework on , you know , or or maybe go and do some research on themselves .

Speaker 1 1:21:03

Yeah , well , I would say like I love connecting with all kinds of people for any reason , but certainly if anyone has a reason to you know . Follow me , Neil Nines , on Instagram .

Speaker 2 1:21:15

Reach out spell that out .

Speaker 1 1:21:17

I'm going to put it N-I-N-E-S and wants to have a conversation about anything that we've talked about or anything at all . You know , I'm sure that would be great that we've talked about or anything at all . You know , I'm sure that would be great . But certainly if this new artist identity rock , like if you love 90s grunge and electronic stuff and like this sounds exciting to you , I particularly would love to hear from you um , just let me know yeah , I love that and um , but other than that like yeah like , who was the guy that you put me on to the podcaster that you showed me his book ?

Speaker 1 1:21:54

Tim Ferriss yeah . So I will say like , yeah , as far as finding podcasts , I think it's just the idea of exploring and taking time and find stuff that appeals to you , and YouTube algorithm is pretty good at recommending stuff Almost too good . It started with me , with tim ferris and , and I found all kinds of interesting podcasters and podcaster people and concepts . But tim , the tim ferris podcast was the inception of the personal development like me taking action and making that a part of my life more consciously . Love that , um , and was the beginning of me kind of getting out of what felt like a content life , just like doing the nine to five , to beginning to dream and envision and because I think I kept hearing all these stories , all these people that made it like no one knows what they're doing really , but they just like , they just like kept going they're good at pretending they just , yeah , it's like every story and every story just had its serendipity baked in .

Speaker 1 1:23:03

and you know , and I just believe like , yeah , if you just keep going for it , keep keep like feeling like good , like you're doing something good and like you're like making good connections , you're treating people well , like you have a good vibe to bring you know and yeah , like I sure have to catch myself sometimes .

Speaker 2 1:23:27

Every now and then , right Dust your knees off .

Speaker 1 1:23:29

You know Like sure I have to catch myself sometimes , Right .

Speaker 2 1:23:30

But um your knees off .

Speaker 1 1:23:31

But uh , yeah , like , yeah , things can happen . Like , go for it , Try it , Just try experiment . Like you know , there's a salsa class I've been meaning to take and I haven't done it . There you go .

Speaker 2 1:23:42

Like . I'm pretty good at like pushing myself outside the comfort zone , but then you know I still get stuck in certain areas .

Speaker 1 1:23:52

Yeah , of course . So , yeah , this is my commitment to take one salsa class . They just show

Advice From Future Self

Speaker 1 1:23:57

up . I don't know anyone here , or maybe , maybe I do right , uh , you know what ?

Speaker 2 1:24:02

I have something . Uh , I wait a second . Is that a phone ringing ? Right , real quick ? Yes , hello , is this neil eights ? Oh , okay , yeah , well , guess what ? I have someone here who wants to uh speak with you , and , uh , he , I think he wants to give you some advice . I'm actually I'm not sure he wants to talk to you , though , but this is you in the future , just so you know . Somebody wants to talk to you , though , but this is you in the future , just so you know . Somebody wants to talk to you , dude what's up , buddy ?

Speaker 2 1:24:34

this is your older self don't cover , try and make sure so the other .

Speaker 1 1:24:39

this is your older self and I have been thinking about what to tell you , what advice to give , and certainly don't want to give away too much and alter the course of the learning . But yeah , you were more of a punk than you thought you were , than you think you are , but that's okay . At least you learned and you succeeded in many different ways . So if you can figure the discipline thing out and accountability thing out and focus on that earlier , go for it . But if not , that's all good too . If you got to live through that party lifestyle and VIP and being a scene-ster and think that's the most important thing , like , go ahead . But it's definitely not . So get out of that bullshit . And um , yeah , man , start thinking about fashion a little bit earlier too . I know it's the , yeah , it's still like early two thousands , but I think we could have stepped that up a little bit . But just keep doing you and yeah , it's , it's , it's a beautiful journey , and just keep pushing forward . Love you , kiddo forward .

Speaker 2 1:26:13

Love you kiddo . Listen to everything he says , because you end up being a pretty cool dude . All right , peace , nice , nice , awesome . All right , let's , let's roll into some rapid fire real quick . I didn't even tell you about this , but I'm about to uh , I'm about to hit you up with some questions here . Okay , and basically , how this works is I'm going to ask you , like , if one thing or the other , or you know something that you like or something that you don't like . I think it's pretty easy , but we want to go with a rapid fire , so I want you to try and be as quick as possible . If you don't know , you can say I don't know . Okay , all right , sounds good . Put three minutes on the board . You ready ?

Speaker 1 1:26:56

Yes .

Speaker 2 1:26:56

Okay . Coffee or tea . Coffee Star Wars or Star Trek . Star Wars Okay . Favorite Friends cast member Chandler , oh yeah . What's your dream car ? If money was no object , lamborghini . Who would you spend a day in the life of ? Pass , okay , iphone or Android . Iphone Text or phone call . Phone call , organize playlists or putting it all on shuffle . Pass , what age would you want to be Sorry ? What age would you want to stay for the rest of your life ? 35 . Earbuds or headphones Both Scariest villain .

Speaker 1 1:27:55

Freddy Krueger .

Speaker 2 1:27:57

He was like in my head .

Speaker 1 1:27:59

I saw him . This guy is coming at me with the claws .

Speaker 2 1:28:02

Doritos or Pringles Doritos Worst pizza , topping Anchovy Spinners or Sprewells Doritos Worst pizza , topping Anchovy Spinners or .

Speaker 1 1:28:14

Sprewells what Pass .

Speaker 2 1:28:21

If you could spend 24 hours with any celebrity , who would it be ? Keith Richards , what's one thing you've always wanted to do but haven't Kite surfing ? If you could pick any season all year round , what would it be ? Fall , east Coast or West Coast East Coast Favorite subject in school History . Best music duo , the first thing that came to mind Hall Oates , my choice . Nothing against them . But there you go . All right , name one pokemon that's not pikachu . All right , you walk into a casino right now .

Speaker 2 1:29:03

What's the first thing ? You're playing the cheapest blackjack table I can find all right . What's your spirit animal wolf ? What's my spirit animal wolf ? The pack baby . All right . Favorite member of the beatles uh george .

Speaker 1 1:29:26

No , now it's paul .

Speaker 2 1:29:29

Now it's Paul . Okay , it's Paul . Okay , all right . What's one thing you can't live without Love . Love , that Favorite curse word . That's not really a curse word .

Speaker 1 1:29:48

Bro Okay .

Speaker 2 1:29:49

Favorite color Blue bro okay favorite color blue .

Speaker 1 1:29:54

Any particular type of blue like a , like a dark french royal blue , like , like some , like fancy ass french hotel and the walls are just blue , just blue Blue , love it , love it .

Speaker 2 1:30:10

Just blue Blue , all right . Planes , trains or automobiles , planes , let's go , let's go . If you had to listen to one song for the rest of your life , what would it be Dream On ? Yes , most unique instrument .

Speaker 1 1:30:30

Most a flout . Yes , most unique instrument , most , uh , a flout , a flute , I don't know what a flout is Okay , love it All right .

Speaker 2 1:30:38

Favorite kind of flower Uh Rose . Okay , there you go , daytime or nighttime . Daytime Any a daytime for sure . Any superpower , what would it be ? Uh , teleportation , okay . If you could be any sea animal , what would it be and why ?

Speaker 1 1:31:02

I would be a dolphin , because I mean duh yeah , duh , yeah , duh .

Speaker 2 1:31:08

All right , last one , coconut or pineapple .

Speaker 1 1:31:13

Oh , I mean , combined is the best . Oh good , pina colada , Um , but pineapple , if I had to pick one .

Speaker 2 1:31:19

All right , there you go . Bomb drop Is that . Is that the wrap , that's the final .

Speaker 1 1:31:24

That is the wrap . Hey , that is the final that is the wrap .

Speaker 2 1:31:26

Hey , listen , dude . Neil , you have been an absolute pleasure .

Speaker 1 1:31:31

Likewise .

Speaker 2 1:31:31

You are a very inspiring person and the whole zen-like feel . I really do sense that and I feel that and that's kind of why I brought you in today to speak with the Respect perspectives podcast audience and , uh , I'm sure they can learn , or I hope that they can learn something from this . And uh , do you have any last uh words that you want to ? Any maybe words of wisdom or any advice or anything that uh you want to give

Respecting Perspectives and Living Your Best

Speaker 2 1:32:04

?

Speaker 1 1:32:04

give uh , you know the people , or uh , or just peace out well , I respect you for doing this and , uh , and Matt , and , and this place , um , you know , uh , the the rhythm royales have been incredible . Um , hopefully , you know that's something that people will find out about more and more . Um , getting people together . Baltimore , like , is known for its music scene , I think you know . More opportunities to bring people together is exciting for me because I think part of my life will always be here . I just wanted to say that and give gratitude and , yeah , I mean I believe , anyone that can follow their dream and and wants to get their life in a better place . Focus on your health and body and the mind will follow . You know , that's definitely been true for me and and it's it's a roller coaster all the time , but at least the overall trajectory has been good and something that , yeah , I don't take for granted , you know so but , yeah , just live your best life and respect perspectives .

Speaker 2 1:33:28

Respect perspectives . All right , hey , dream on , dream on . Catch you next time . Peace .